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Boycott the Boycott of The Golden CompassForum Discussion for Boycott the Boycott of The Golden Compass 12next ›last » Submitted by Lynn S. on Sun, 11/02/2008 - 05:03
OMG people are having flame wars on this petition. Getting too touchy about what they believe. The movie shouldnt be taken away coz of the beliefs of one religion. WHY DO PEOPLE ALWAYS THINK THEIR RELIGION IS THE ALMIGHTY!?!?!? Yea... cyber screaming. Submitted by hannah w. on Fri, 08/22/2008 - 20:50
seriously, i mean, people here boast that we have a constituition, and then they go in streets saying take away this movie, i dont beleive in the relgion in it? i am a proud christian, and though i might not beleive in your religion, i will not get mad at you if you put in a movie! thank u for making this and thank u for signing it!!!!! THANK YOU!!!! Submitted by Trinity H. on Thu, 01/10/2008 - 18:00
Responce to Timothy D. First off I mean no offence to you or anyone else although some may take offence its just my view of things! The answer to the first question is MAN determins who is innocent and guilty even in forgiveness we are judged by our own and yes we are all corrupt in our own way because of our society today, and that we allow it to happen! If our religious practices are corrupt, how can we not be corrupted by them as they are the ones who give us the word of god? Submitted by Timothy D. on Sat, 01/12/2008 - 01:52
I understand how you might see things this way, and frankly these are some good questions; however some of your responses are scattered and need answered. Therefore, I want to help you understand....and hopefully you accept it gracefully. First off, I believe that the Bible was written down by man in Greek and Hebrew; but in a supernatural work of the Holy Spirit of God was written by God. Peter says, For prophecy came not in old time by the will of man; but holy men of God spoke as they were carried by the Holy Spirit. So much so, that every word is what we call inspired...or God-breathed. In my study of this book for quite a few years now, I found the authenticity, unity, and prophecy of it amazing! I have never found a question that could not be answered. Some say there are contradictions; but they are simply misunderstandings by the reader. For instance, Paul says that salvation is by faith alone.... and James says that salvation without works is dead. But overall, this is not a contradiction because salvation throughout the whole Bible is by faith; yet anyone who is saved demonstrates it by works. Additionally, Paul was speaking to a different audience than James was. James was talking to a bunch a people who claimed they were Christians; yet lived like the devil. They were resting on their laurels. Anyway, another point is that you cannot just take a verse from the Bible and understand it if you have no concept of what the whole book is about. That would be like reading one sentence out of a book and claiming to have read it. Finally, the manuscript evidence of Scripture was not handed down like the circle game you mentioned. If I asked you "how many translations of the Bible there are?" How would you respond? The answer is: there is only one translation. A translation from Hebrew to English; which is based on all the ancient manuscripts. (If your unsure what I mean, please ask) In short, all of the contemporary translations are simply using different words to explain the same thing. In the verse in Peter above, I removed the word SPAKE and used SPOKE so that you would not have an archaiac word to decipher. Pertaining to our discussion, ONLY God determines truth and righteousness! God created a 'good' creation and man violated and severed the relationship with God by disobedience. In response to your letter...Man cannot determine who is innocent and guilty if he is corrupted. You may ask, how do I then make this assertion to you? Because God has directed me by His Word (the Bible) and Spirit to live like one of His disciples. In so doing, I am simply explaining this truth that comes from His Word. Sometimes, I am as guilty as the next guy....but certainly not evil in sharing this with you. Religion; which has been corrupted is different than having a relationship with God. Religion is simply how I worship God. In other words, if I want to show reverence to God by at least worshipping Him with other believers one day a week; then I go to church. If I believe God is more important to me than money; then I give my money to charity in His name. The corruption that you refer to is derived from men who either take advantage of their position to con people or simply have made terrible mistakes by being self-deceived. My point here is that although there are wrong actions in the name of religion; there are also people who love God and want to follow His Word. I too, at one time believed that organized religion was just thorougly corrupted and did not want to be a part of it; but then after becoming closer to God realized that he wanted me to be there for them..if not for me. You assert that religion and judgment was used as a way to to keep men at peace. The Bible very clearly shows how the 'very intent of the hearts' of men/women was only evil continually; whether religion existed or not! And are you actually saying that the Creator of everything we know does not have to have justice. Some believe that God is just some bleeding heart in the sky that ooooozes with Love; but are we to believe that men like Hitler should not have justice administered to them? Do you not demand justice for the wrongs committed against you? You can blame it on whoever you want and never have justice? Yet, the Bible explains that God is both HOLY and JUST; which means hell was created for Satan and his demons, and finally at judgment most will go there. I say most because it is described as the broad road that leads to destruction. And what is even more interesting is: God does not have to send people there! They go of their own free will! You, by your own words have stated that "we allow it to happen." We are all evil in God's eyes; because we break His laws. Let me ask you a few questions: Would man make laws that he knew he could not keep? Are the laws that God made bad?....or are they the very best thing for us? God says do not lie, or steal. Would you want someone to lie to you, or steal from you? Would you feel good about yourself lying or stealing? I agree with God that all His laws are "good" and that we should try to obey them. Concerning the flood, it was Noah and his family that were saved (not Moses). And that is a good question by the way! The Bible says that every person was evil! When you understand the story in context, it also remains that even Noah and his family were evil. OK....now your your thinking...WHAT! It's true! It says Noah was blameless only because he had faith in God. THE PRIMARY REASON THAT ANYONE WAS SAVED IS BECAUSE GOD WAS MERCIFUL. EVERYONE DESERVED TO BE DESTROYED. IT WAS ONLY BY THE GRACE OF GOD THAT NOAH AND HIS FAMILY WERE GIVEN A NEW START. Today, evil and sin continue to be man's greatest problem and leads to the death of everyone. Physical and spiritual death. Because all men/women are guilty before God, the only way of salvation is by God's grace through faith. Ephesians says, for it is by grace you have been saved, through faith; and not of yourselves....it is a gift of God. Not by works....meaning you can't work your way to Heaven. and also....for all have sinned and fallen short of God's glory. We have failed God in his original intentions for creation. Finally, the only way to know God and what is truly righteous is to believe. Some say that you have to do this....and that....then the other thing! The Bible says, confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead and you will be saved. And also, everyone that calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved! I started by examining if any of this could be true and had to have solid proof in so many areas. After years of study, I have never found anything contrary to what I believe is the truth. Additionally, I do not think that God saved made me one of His right away because I did not live what I said I believed. But then as I studied his word and lived it out in the best intentions; I believe the Spirit of God made a supernatural change in my life. It totally transformed me...and is still daily changing me. My hope is that you may find that kind of peace because "there is no other name under heaven; by which men/women can be saved." PS. Man was just as culpable for the sin in the garden as was a women. They were equally guilty before God! Even though, the man was influenced by the women to sin; he made the choice! Man was wrong, with or without the women. Finally, a women's worth is not questioned in Christianity...in fact, it is elevated! When God created man and women it was 'good'. There was no inequality in God's eyes. And the New Testament further says that there is no inequality. Blessings Submitted by Trinity H. on Sun, 01/20/2008 - 20:25
Open mouth and insert foot its what I’m good at. Submitted by Trinity H. on Thu, 01/10/2008 - 17:52
I believe its just the author i didnt see anything that would lead me astray from a loving god! Cudos to you for supporting your fellow man.
Submitted by Laura P. on Fri, 01/04/2008 - 03:48
So, did the movie reflect all the bad crap people are saying or is it just the author? I believe in god, and attend a fun church. I also have friends that dont believe the same as me. Thats their business. But, my neice and nephew love Harry Potter and Lord Of The Rings, which most christians think is terrible by what they have heard from others, and know nothing about. I loved them too!! Is this crap or not? In the movie, can you tell he doesnt believe in god? I mean being christians you cant just surround yourself with only christian people or things. I am looked down at because of a place I enjoy eating, that is owned by an athiest. (That I am helping him survive.) So what? How many people make our clothes, serve our food, sell us cars, work at the grocery store that dont believe in god or believe different? Maybe one day theyll wake up. Submitted by Timothy D. on Thu, 01/03/2008 - 08:09
Oh yeah.... and as far as the movie goes....I don't care! Anybody who thinks this movie thing is important needs to find something better to do. Who cares who wrote the movie, what they believe? Personally, the movie trailer looked dumb and I have better things to do than spend my money seeing this garbage. People have a choice to see the movie or not and I doubt that the philosophy is that great that it would damage little psychi's forever. Further, go see it! Looks like a much better quality Narnia is coming out soon. CS Lewis wrote his novels fifty years ago and they are still great on the big screen today. Put Narnia up against Compass and then try and tell me how great Compass is when it comes to fantasy! And frankly, I would like a Christian (and i am one) to tell me what verse in Scripture tells them to condemn entertainment. In fact, if Christians were truly following Christ, we would not have this issue in the first place. Submitted by Timothy D. on Thu, 01/03/2008 - 07:56
TRINITY H: My purpose in responding to yours is to help you think about what you have stated. First, who determines who is innocent and guilty? When you say that we are "subject to corrupt government, judges, and religion!" But, do not stop there! I believe all humanity is corrupt... including me! When you say that organizations are corrupt, do you also include yourself?.... or are you perfectly righteous? We all argue with each other about how we are right and he is wrong; but what about us all being wrong? CERTAINLY WE SHOULD ALL GIVE OTHERS MORE GRACE! In my belief system, I look at the Ten Commandments...God's Law (the Moral Law-Giver who righteously determines who is truly right); who says such things as do not steal, do not lie, do not murder...things that hurt nobody except the one who violate that law. Our sin is not so much against others; but against Him who grieves at how we treat other people. Religion has been used to control people; but that does not mean that we cannot have a personal relationship with the God who loves you and I and wants the very best for us by giving this law. Finally, in having this love relationship with God; could He in His great grace and mercy not ask to be worshipped in a particular way? God Bless You! Submitted by Trinity H. on Tue, 01/01/2008 - 21:10
I wish we could live in a perfect society where we could all be accepted for our beliefs and not be judged by them where the innocent are inocent until proven guilty and the guilty are proven guilty. But we dont live in that world anymore we are subject to corrupt government, judges, and religon. On top of all of that we have to listen to people tell us our books and movies are corrupt and religously incorrect. I stopped going to church when i was young because i didnt want to be told how i should worship and love my god. churches have some people so screwed up that they think that anyone who doesnt follow thier religion is Hell bound. When are we going to realise that we can love god in our own way and leave it be. Religion is just another way to try to run peoples lives and if your ok with that then thats your buisness just leave the rest of us out of it. I personally took my 5 year old daughter to this movie and we absolutely loved it. They just have issues because the author of this book announced his religion. To each thier own i say.
Submitted by Timothy D. on Mon, 12/31/2007 - 05:14
Anyone can quote the Bible and use it against others.....and You can even say it is not righteous to see a re-creation of the death of Christ; but the ones who are truly right (as in righteous) are the ones who live for Jesus, as He is their Lord and Savior. I have not seen the Passion, but I have watched movies that I should not have seen...it was a sin against God to affect myself by watching such garbage....but despite that fact.... God has said that I am forgiven and in view of His grace and mercy I will stand before Him at the judgement and claim that I trusted in Jesus' substitutionary sacrifice for me on the cross, which according to His Word has paid for my sin. These are those he calls righteous...the ones who truly try to be his disciples. In short, the things that are truly righteous are the things that God call righteous. Submitted by Nevin M. on Tue, 12/25/2007 - 20:34
As a beleiver in ENLIGHTENED philosophy, I plan to see the movie to support a fellow believer. Im personally glad the religious nuts wont be there because most of those people are very ignorant and unpleasant to be around. The so called "Christians" only like movies that have extended torture scenes like that pornographic movie "The Passion of the Christ". Im uncomfortable around any group of people who enjoy watching torture. Submitted by Brad A. on Mon, 12/17/2007 - 05:14
I can quote the bible too. "A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, she must be silent." Timothy 2:11 Submitted by Mitch T. on Sat, 12/15/2007 - 16:53
If the pasture at my church was really religious like he is trying to portray to everyone, then why did he buy a jet for his family? that doesn't seem very christian to me. Submitted by Megan I. on Sat, 12/15/2007 - 16:31
i believe that every human is entitled to their own beliefs and besides the book is fiction not a true fact or story it was a persons creativity and just because it was really creativity and now a movie doesn't make it any different Submitted by Wendy F. on Fri, 12/14/2007 - 13:14
I think if Jesus were alive he would be horrified at the suffering and murder that has been and still is committed in his name. He would run through the various religious houses and turn them over to the needy kicking out the dessicated and archaic structure of people that have been making a living for ages by convincing everyone that only they can be conduits between ordinary folk and God in heaven. He would send the comfy Christians down to where the homeless sleep and tell them to stop ringing the doorbells of home owning surburbanites but feed the hungry and care for them. Did Jesus ever say Christianity was a palace filled with treasure while children starve to death? Did he ever say it was parading around in silks and lace, smelling of ashes of roses? Did he ever say it was torture? murder? If you are a narrow minded biggot you wont want want to see The Golden Compass because it is too near to the truth and the path religion has taken and there you lie reflected.
Submitted by Timothy D. on Thu, 12/13/2007 - 02:51
Some ofthe better evidences of the Bible are it's unity of authorship; it's prophecy; and it's flat out truth. If God were not giving the very words, then none of the many authors (who had various backgrounds at differnet times) would agree in their material. Just try and compare psuedographic writings to the actual Scripture and tell me it has the same unity. Also, it's prophecy is amazing! Not just the many prophecies that Christ fulfilled; but when the nations of Babylon, Medo-Persia; Greece; and Rome are predicted hundreds of years before their appearances right down to the leaders leading them..... Christ fulfilled over 200 hundred prophecies, yet just fulfilling 68 of them has the probability of 10 to the 17th power. It looks like this: 100000000000000000. Just 68! Now, what about the fact that when the Scripture makes someone look bad, they don't cover up their story by putting themselves in a good light. Finally, you produce any other historical document that tells of a man that is raised from the dead. Many theories have been raised attempting to deny it, yet none have succeeded. In Scripture, it is mentioned that they placed a Roman guard at the tomb to prevent someone from stealing the body. In other words, there was an accusation that it was stolen. If that was the case, then why did they not produce the body and put an end to the thought that Jesus was resurrected? It's interesting how many get on here and post, yet don't have any facts to back up their arguments! Submitted by Andrew v. on Thu, 12/13/2007 - 09:11
The Ancient Greek story of Alcestis tells of Heracles rescuing a dead woman from the underworld. The story of Protesilaus tells of a dead hero being allowed to visit his grieving wife. The ancient Egyptians worshipped Osiris, the god who dies and came to life again, and the Mithraic religion, from which Christianity gets a lot of its symbolism, seems to have had a similar belief about the god Mithras. Admittedly, these are all myths, but so are the stories of the resurrections of Lazarus and of Jesus. Submitted by Timothy D. on Thu, 01/03/2008 - 08:27
Good story-telling; but obviously you did not understand my post. Your assertion is that because myth exists that truth does not? WOW! Mythology is known to be mythology; but Scripture is an archeologically reliable and historically attested document. You mention all of these 'gods' (little "g"); which have no basis in reality, whether they were worshipped or not (people would worship a rock if they thought it would make a difference). Not only were these things attested to by supposedly biased Christian writers (all writers are biased, by the way); but by other historians like Tacitus. in fact, the Bible is recognized in scholarly circles as being one of the most historically accurate books ever composed. Most ancient literature that we have comes hundreds of years later. And yet, it is the most questioned? Nobody doubts Shakespeare, but the Bible is more historically accurate and it is questioned! By the way, by way of your argument.... you trust the sources you have listed more than the Bible? Mythology vs. History? How ridiculous! Submitted by Timothy D. on Thu, 12/13/2007 - 02:37
BRAD SAYS: "The bible was written my many people over many years and when any person writes a book they are always going to have a biased view and cannot just present the facts." When in fact, The Bible is word-for-word biased with only facts! It's called verbal-plenary inspiration. hehehe Submitted by Wesley S. on Sun, 12/30/2007 - 21:27
Timothy D, I believe the same thing, verbal plenary, but I really don't know it's possible to explain to a non-believer. Some consider the gospels to be taken from other religions and not eye-witness accounts, but again that is their view and they are entitled to it, so what can you do? It's his opinion and I think discussing these issues is useless. I think we Christians base our beliefs more on faith and historical events don't have the same importance to us. But one thing about the Nicence Creed said here is not exactly true. Before the establishment of the formal Catholic church, christian churches did exist all during the time when Rome had outlawed Christianity and began a series of persecutions. The church did have a central organizational structure long before Nicene and this structure's birth is first described in the Book of Acts and Pauls Letters and it's history was carried on and documented by Polycarp, one of the apostle John's disciples, after the destruction of Jerusalem. The original apostles creed and the authentic scriptures and the four gospels were established by this first church structure which was established by the twelve apostles and remained in place until the creation of the Roman Catholic Church. Jesus' disciple John was still alive when versions of Matthew, Mark and Luke were written and being circulated and John was called upon with other church leaders to confirm which versions were authentic. It was this action of authenticaling the earliest New Testament canon that is thought by some to be the impetus for the apostle John to write his own gospel which could be seen to be written by the apostle himself so there could be mistake as to it's authorship and also records more of Jesus conversations with others which he felt would be of more use to the gentile Christian community. Most christian churches did not see the council of Nicene as being a governing body at all, it was a showcase for an Emporer whose christian subjects still very much distrusted the Roman Government. Constantine only banned the persecution of Christians, he did not make it the official religion of the Roman Empire. The Nicene creed was not really written in Nicene but was a slightly reworded version of the Apostles creed. Versions of the original apostles creed still exist that predate Nicene by almost 200 years. These versions and authorative gospels were preseved by the chruch in the Roman Province of Briton which served as a refuge for many Christians during various persecutions and predate both the establishment of the Roman Catholic Church and the Council of Nicene by 200 years. The Roman Province of Briton was so far away from Rome it was thought to be the safest destination for persecuted Christians who lived in other Roman provinces. The church in the Roman Province of Briton is the first to have a formal structure that we would recognize today. It's structure and the structure of monastaries and teaching monastaries in Ireland both remained in place as a seperate organiztions until they agreed to join the Roman Catholic church almost 300 years after the collapse of the Roman empire. I think that so much Christian history is written in text books by non-Christians based on facts that they see. Christians have what we call the red thread of the canon and our history has been documented and any Christian who wants to can read up on early church history. And we do have it recorded, so what would we gain by discussing the importance of the councel of nicene? And I guess would any Christrian really want to go over all that material? Submitted by Timothy D. on Thu, 01/03/2008 - 08:42
I think I agree with your summation of history, for the most part anyway without checking a few facts; but the reason that the ressurection, history, unity, and prophecy are so important is the validity of something that is true. Any rational person, whether a Christian or not, should consider objective truth. The Bible is a history book, not a mythology book or legend. The facts can be verified through archeology and historical textual criticism. Scholars have determined its validity as any rational person can study and understand. I would question the idea that Peter was the first Pope by challenging a Catholic's interpretation of the Scripture that supports that idea. (and the purpose of the Catholic church to gain power and establish apostolic authority) But, I would agree wholeheartedly with the Catholic concerning the historical validity of the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. Which is more important? Certainly not the papal issue! Submitted by Aqua B. on Sun, 12/23/2007 - 21:35
You do realize that it has been proven that when the bible was interpreted, some of the preist modified what it said so support what they said, because they were the only ones who could read it. Submitted by Michael M. on Thu, 12/13/2007 - 17:02
Dude, what do you think the Council of Nicea was? A gathering of many different people so they could finally decide to tell everyone what to believe and what not to believe. And if God truely spoke to everyone, why did they have to leave so many books out of the Bible approved at the Council? By your arguement they should have all been nearly the same, hence no reason to reject any of the books - but they did. To top it all, the council was held in 325 CE. Jesus is believed to have died in 36 CE at the latest. How do you account for the nearly 300 years between his death and first ever council of christians - a council that is said to have established the christian doctirne? Submitted by Eduardo B. on Wed, 12/12/2007 - 21:26
Brad A: When talking about God hard evidence is not easy to come by. You can see the work of God in people's lives whether ot not you accept it or believe it. You can think you don't need God and it's ok. Go on and continue your life without Him but don't mock/hate/ridicule those who need Him and believe in Him. They know the difference His pressence has made in their lives, again whether you accept it or not. God asked Christians to go and spread His Word all over the world. And that's what Christians (of all denominations) have been doing for the last 2,000 years. If you don't want to hear them, no problem, they should leave you alone and walk away. If you were born in a Christian home but want out of Christianity, no problem, walk away. But don't blame other Christians if you don't see God with your own eyes, or if you can't touch Him with your hands, or if you don't hear Him with your ears. He is spiritual. I'm sure you have first hand knowledge that you are more than flesh and bones. There is more to you than matter. Our God is not material... but you'll be able to see Him, touch Him, hear Him with that "other part" of yourself... if you just allow it. The problem with our God for people like you is that He demands from us a way of living that's hard to live. Very, very hard. It's not easy being a Christian. In fact, if it were a job it would be the hardest job in the world. Just try to imagine how many times your boss would fire you for not doing your job right. So don't think that being a Christian is a bed of roses. But we Christians accept the challenge regardless of all the ridicule nonbelievers will throw at us. Jesus Himself said it 2,000 years ago: Before the world depises you, the world despised Me.
From all that above to the Golden Compass: freedom of speech grants anyone the right to give advise, to express an opinion. And from what I've read here all I can see is Christians advising other Christians to avoid that film. You can't denied them the right they have under the Constitution to advise other Christians. All you can do is take or leave their advise. Want to see the movie? Go. Want to follow the advise? Don't go. Even more, you can advise us not to take the advise given by Christians here. It's your right. But if you are not a Christian then, why bother? The advise is not meant to you. Submitted by Michael M. on Wed, 12/12/2007 - 21:57
Eddy, buddy, this is a petition AGAINST the boycott of the Golden Compass. This is not a forumn for your so-called advice. But since you bring it up - what exactly is this advice based on? What some religious authority has told you, just as they have told you for 2,000 years? I believe the only advice worth giving is advice that originates from the source - in this case the movie, or better yet, the books. Advising against something you don't really know about it pure, blind, ignorance (but a lot of you Christians live for that i suppose).  Loading People... |
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